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Author Topic: The motorcycle thread  (Read 4230 times)

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Brooklynrider

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #15 on: January 19, 2018, 07:42:08 PM »
A total-loss oiling system almost never means that the engine actually leaks oil. How often do you see a puddle of oil under a 2-stroke? Now how often do you see an oil leak under a shovelhead? A total-loss oiling system simply means that oil gets consumed during the engine's use and needs to be replenished a lot sooner.

Regardless, Harley stopped using total-loss nearly a century ago. The "misconception" started during the era of the shovelhead, when harleys were notorious for having engine components machined off-spec, bolts loosening due to vibration, or the chain oiling system failing. Don't really see why you're getting upset since you have a sportster, one of their more reliable bikes.

Offline Aesop Rock

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #16 on: January 20, 2018, 05:04:26 PM »
A total-loss oiling system almost never means that the engine actually leaks oil. How often do you see a puddle of oil under a 2-stroke? Now how often do you see an oil leak under a shovelhead? A total-loss oiling system simply means that oil gets consumed during the engine's use and needs to be replenished a lot sooner.

Regardless, Harley stopped using total-loss nearly a century ago. The "misconception" started during the era of the shovelhead, when harleys were notorious for having engine components machined off-spec, bolts loosening due to vibration, or the chain oiling system failing. Don't really see why you're getting upset since you have a sportster, one of their more reliable bikes.

"Let’s rewind to earlier days. Until 1936 (for the overhead-valve bikes) and 1937 (for the side-valves), Harley engines did not have provisions to circulate the oil through the engine more than once. This style of lubrication system is known today as “total loss.” Oil made its way through the engine and then was ejected onto the roadway. This was not exclusive to H-D. It was common for stationary and agricultural engines at the time to expel oil directly onto the ground. This system became impractical as engines advanced, but for the time, it was acceptable practice. In fact, modern two-strokes are still total-loss with regard to the lubricating oil."

https://www.revzilla.com/common-tread/wtatwta-why-harleys-leak

Of course Shovelheads are gonna leak oil man, things are 30-50 years old. AMF shovels were known to have some issues, but they had more to do with electrical problems than machining tolerances. Ironheads, yeah totally different story, but most issues with Shovels was due to ignorance of the owners and their inability to properly turn a wrench.

I'm not mad, I just hate when people talk about shit they have no idea about.

Brooklynrider

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #17 on: January 20, 2018, 07:39:33 PM »
A total-loss oiling system almost never means that the engine actually leaks oil. How often do you see a puddle of oil under a 2-stroke? Now how often do you see an oil leak under a shovelhead? A total-loss oiling system simply means that oil gets consumed during the engine's use and needs to be replenished a lot sooner.

Regardless, Harley stopped using total-loss nearly a century ago. The "misconception" started during the era of the shovelhead, when harleys were notorious for having engine components machined off-spec, bolts loosening due to vibration, or the chain oiling system failing. Don't really see why you're getting upset since you have a sportster, one of their more reliable bikes.

"Let’s rewind to earlier days. Until 1936 (for the overhead-valve bikes) and 1937 (for the side-valves), Harley engines did not have provisions to circulate the oil through the engine more than once. This style of lubrication system is known today as “total loss.” Oil made its way through the engine and then was ejected onto the roadway. This was not exclusive to H-D. It was common for stationary and agricultural engines at the time to expel oil directly onto the ground. This system became impractical as engines advanced, but for the time, it was acceptable practice. In fact, modern two-strokes are still total-loss with regard to the lubricating oil."

https://www.revzilla.com/common-tread/wtatwta-why-harleys-leak

Of course Shovelheads are gonna leak oil man, things are 30-50 years old. AMF shovels were known to have some issues, but they had more to do with electrical problems than machining tolerances. Ironheads, yeah totally different story, but most issues with Shovels was due to ignorance of the owners and their inability to properly turn a wrench.

I'm not mad, I just hate when people talk about shit they have no idea about.
Come on dude, It was just a joke. Sure there is truth to what you are saying, but Harleys are known for leaking and not everyone who claims that is just uneducated about ancient oiling systems. I ride with many people who own Harleys. Some have reliable shovelheads, others have troublesome twin-cams. Any bike can be reliable if properly cared for but statistically speaking, Harleys leak oil more commonly than other brands and that speaks for itself.

Just to be clear, I'm not someone who hates american bikes. In fact, I will probably be purchasing a shovelhead this year if the right one pops up.

Offline joelite44

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #18 on: January 22, 2018, 09:59:25 AM »
Brooklynrider  I was about to buy that 80 something Virago too, but my neighbor gave it away to his brother. Then no virago for me, then I looked onto the s40's for the price. And I ultimately found a 97' Savage which is what i have now.


Brooklynrider

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #19 on: January 22, 2018, 12:26:44 PM »
Brooklynrider  I was about to buy that 80 something Virago too, but my neighbor gave it away to his brother. Then no virago for me, then I looked onto the s40's for the price. And I ultimately found a 97' Savage which is what i have now.


Honestly, you probably dodged a bullet. 80s bikes in general are usually super over-complicated which leads to a whole bunch of unnecessary problems. Aside from the starter issues that they are known for, I pulled about 30-40 pounds of useless stuff off including about 40 wires. It is nice having a bike that makes more power than a modern 1200cc one while being half the weight though.

I think you went in the right direction with a single cylinder as a first bike, especially if you plan on wrenching on it.

Offline joelite44

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #20 on: January 22, 2018, 12:39:02 PM »
Yes indeed. I wanted a motorcycle to ride and fix. It can be very therapeutic.

Offline tario

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #21 on: January 29, 2018, 12:42:40 PM »
Well, may as well post my Honda cb650.(I tried but i'm too lazy/stupid to upload a picture) My bike has developed a total loss oiling system too. So far I've rebuilt the carbs, head, front brake, swapped the alloy wheels for spokes, lowered gauges and headlight, added windshield. This past year I picked up a Triumph Trophy 1200. It's a great bike but rides aren't the same with a full fairing and quiet exhaust.

I second the savage being a good choice. Carb kits add up when maintenance time comes round. Then there is syncing the carbs (if there is more than one). ...although I still dream of getting a honda cbx with a 6 cylinder engine...
"forgot to turn my swag off last night and woke up covered in bitches"

Offline joelite44

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #22 on: January 29, 2018, 01:42:57 PM »
I really don't know much about motorcycles but I wish to learn so I can work on them myself.

What do I need to know about adjusting carburators? do they need to be fully rebuilt to adjust them? do they use gaskets?

My motorcycle motor is fully rebuilt with make-a-gasket and no gasket at all.

Offline tario

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #23 on: January 29, 2018, 02:25:57 PM »
Most carb problems happen when the bike sits. If things are running really poorly you need to clean out your carbs. There should be a fuel/air mixture screw. That's pretty much the only adjustment you'll need for tuning. Your best bet is to find a guide for your bike. The end game is to have your spark plug tan coloured. If not enough gas is getting through you will have white spark plugs, If too much gets through you'll have black plugs. Oil can cause blackness too. There is also an adjustment for idle. You can adjust an idle stopper so that the throttle returns to 1000rpm or 2000rpm when you let go. (I think most should be set just over 1000rpm)

For the more technical parts of how a carb works; There is a slow jet that allows gas through when the bike idles. At full throttle the main jet will be supplying most of the gas. In between it will slowly transition. The fuel screw adjusts the opening in the fuel line. (sort of)

The reason one carb is handy for maintenance is; To tune most 1970's Honda fours for example you need to set the timing, then valve clearances(otherwise you could tune to accommodate improper settings), then you set your fuel mixture on each carb, Then you have to hook up 4 vacuum gauges to each of the 4 carbs and adjust the setting on each carb slide so you have identical vacuum readings at idle, half throttle, then full. One carb doesn't need this last step.

I learned the most from reading clymers and hanes manuals. Definitely worth picking up. Just read through once or twice before you dig into anything. Some instructions are unclear or they tell you how to take something apart and then say "do the reverse to assemble"
"forgot to turn my swag off last night and woke up covered in bitches"

Offline joelite44

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #24 on: January 29, 2018, 03:02:28 PM »
Most carb problems happen when the bike sits. If things are running really poorly you need to clean out your carbs. There should be a fuel/air mixture screw. That's pretty much the only adjustment you'll need for tuning. Your best bet is to find a guide for your bike. The end game is to have your spark plug tan coloured. If not enough gas is getting through you will have white spark plugs, If too much gets through you'll have black plugs. Oil can cause blackness too. There is also an adjustment for idle. You can adjust an idle stopper so that the throttle returns to 1000rpm or 2000rpm when you let go. (I think most should be set just over 1000rpm)

For the more technical parts of how a carb works; There is a slow jet that allows gas through when the bike idles. At full throttle the main jet will be supplying most of the gas. In between it will slowly transition. The fuel screw adjusts the opening in the fuel line. (sort of)

The reason one carb is handy for maintenance is; To tune most 1970's Honda fours for example you need to set the timing, then valve clearances(otherwise you could tune to accommodate improper settings), then you set your fuel mixture on each carb, Then you have to hook up 4 vacuum gauges to each of the 4 carbs and adjust the setting on each carb slide so you have identical vacuum readings at idle, half throttle, then full. One carb doesn't need this last step.

I learned the most from reading clymers and hanes manuals. Definitely worth picking up. Just read through once or twice before you dig into anything. Some instructions are unclear or they tell you how to take something apart and then say "do the reverse to assemble"

Hello And thanks for your input. I have heard clymers manuals are good for something, I think its worth checking it out since they make one for my motorcycle.

I also have a GY6 moped which I wish to modify and clean so I can make it work flawless. Its also been sitting for around a month since I got my other motorycle. THanks for the input on how to those things work.

Brooklynrider

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #25 on: January 29, 2018, 07:12:33 PM »
My motorcycle motor is fully rebuilt with make-a-gasket and no gasket at all.
This is usually not a good thing. Liquid gaskets have a tendency to ball up inside the motor and clog oil passages when too much is used. It's not uncommon for people to use liquid gasket instead of paper gaskets to lower the cylinder a fraction of a millimeter, effectively increasing your compression ratio and getting a bit more grunt out of the engine however it has to be done correctly. If the time comes around, I would switch back to regular gaskets.

As for carbs, you have one which makes everything a thousand times easier. As long as you keep your exhaust stock, the carb should need no adjusting other than the mixture adjustment. Once you have that set, your bike should run well all year long. Carb rebuild kits really aren't necessary if you remember to turn the petcock off when storing the bike. I personally throw a bit of Seafoam engine cleaner in the gas tank from time to time and my carbs are pristine.

Clymer manuals are the best! Your first tool purchase should be a torque wrench. As long as you're not heavy handed, you can rebuild an entire motor with a clymer and some patience.

Offline joelite44

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #26 on: January 31, 2018, 02:00:58 PM »
Thanks for all the input. I appreciate people with the same passion I have for these machines. Its amazing how long motorvehicles have come. Motorcycles is something I dreamt of being a part of since I was a little kid, they were just too expensive for me and couldnt gather the correct mind to collect one myself. Now I am 27 and old enough to know these things will kill you if you let them. So ride on!
As a kid i used to see my younger cousins race motocross. I was too hyperactive to convince someone to let me on one so I have had the urge to do so since.  ::)

Offline Cole

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #27 on: February 10, 2018, 04:32:03 PM »
A friend of mine sold me his CBR 125 for dirt cheap. Looking forward to keeping it for a couple months, then getting something bigger once I'm comfortable on a bike again.


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Offline joelite44

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #28 on: February 13, 2018, 01:53:17 PM »
That bike is bad! looks nice and they say its funner to ride a slow car fast.

My bike is a total loss system like aesop stated.

Oil is going to the combustion chamber and i need to replace the rings on the piston.

How bad of a job is it? I have a decent sized porch i can dismantle my bike but I have never delt with motors.

Brooklynrider

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Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #29 on: February 13, 2018, 02:39:28 PM »
That bike is bad! looks nice and they say its funner to ride a slow car fast.

My bike is a total loss system like aesop stated.

Oil is going to the combustion chamber and i need to replace the rings on the piston.

How bad of a job is it? I have a decent sized porch i can dismantle my bike but I have never delt with motors.
Not terribly hard but requires a few specialty tools. As previously stated, torque wrench is a must when working on a motor and most other parts on a motorcycle. Compression tester or rather a leak-down tester to determine what exactly is out of tolerance to allow oil into the combustion chamber. Feeler gauges to check piston ring gap and to redo the valve clearances once you are finished. In general, engine work is not something that should be done outside especially if it is going to take longer than one day. A nick in a gasket surface or a speck of dirt in the crankcase is all it takes to ruin an engine. Also be prepared to replace gaskets, they usually fall apart when you take a motor apart. NO SANDING of any engine parts whatsoever. If something does need to be cleaned, make sure you use a material that is softer than what you are sanding such as the green scotchbrite pads. Most importantly be patient, it doesnt pay off to rush something and have to do it again later.

Bikeguide.org - Bike maintenance for BMX'ers

Re: The motorcycle thread
« Reply #29 on: February 13, 2018, 02:39:28 PM »

 

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