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« on: December 02, 2014, 01:06:40 PM »
Not to discredit CMC's science and mathematics.... But just like Bunky said, there is a lot of things you can do to a frame to change the way it feels. Yes, trying to find suitable frame geometry to fit your likings is one of the first steps. But by no means is it the final step.
I currently have a Model C and a Wave C built up. The two are completely different. My Model C is something I more enjoy riding on dirt/jumping where as the Wave C was something I built up for doing more jibbing and grinding in mind. These two bikes have the exact same bottom bracket height, which is something that seems to be getting too much attention in the comments in this thread. The two bikes feel WORLDS apart, simply on how I have them set up.
Wave C is a slammed rear end, as many stack washers that can fit on an uncut steer tube under a Sunday Freeze top load stem with the 7.75" rise Sunday bars, Odyssey tires and Hazard Lite rims. The Model C has the axle hanging out of the back of the drop outs, a shorter stack height (maybe 3-5mm) and the 7.25" Sunday bars, Intense MKIII folding tires and Quadrant rims. The main difference in geometry between the Model C and the Wave C is pretty much just in rear end length, all other angles are the virtually the same. (Now that I think of it, I think the Model C is an 13.75" bb and the Wave C is a 13.8" but I am not 100% on that at the moment)
It is really crazy how different the two bikes feel from one another. The wheels alone change how everything rides. I would even go as far as saying the exact same set up with the different wheels would drastically change how the bike feels just from the rotational weight. For a while I only had one 24" built up which happened to be the Wave C frame. At the time, I was a lot more into riding dirt jumps and cement parks, so I had the bike set up similar to my Model C as far as the bar height and rear end length. It felt exactly what I was after ride feel wise, essentially just like my original Model C's set up.
I think it is also worth noting that I am the same hight as Cullen (CMC4130) and have ridden his Liquid. Once again, not to discredit anything he is bringing to the conversation..... but I really didn't enjoy the way his Liquid was set up. The front end felt too tall and the ass end felt saggy. PLEASE realize that this is my personal riding preference and I completely respect and understand other people like other/different set ups.
Moral of my story...... I really enjoy a low bb on my 20" bikes. 11.5" feels great on all types of terrain. But whenever I ride a 24" that has a lower BB than my Model C/Wave C it simply doesn't really do it for me.
I hope somewhere in this mess of my ongoing disagreements with Cullen's bike set ups (LOL) that you an find some sort of help in what you are after.