Bikeguide.org - Bike maintenance for BMX'ers
The Street => The Bike Shop => Topic started by: Goliath on May 10, 2015, 05:44:59 PM
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Hey guys!
So I just ordered a cross check frameset through the shop I work at and I'm soooo exited to build it up but I'm just unsure on how I should go about doing that.
The bike is going to be used for general use/exploration/touring so I want this bike to be able to handle everything. I am not a fan of drop bars so that's not going to happen. I'm probably gonna go with some flat bars that have some backsweep to them.
Should I go Shimano or Sram? I was kinda thinking of just goin full xt/xtr.
Any thoughts/suggestions?
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Paul Touring Cantis or Minimotos for brakes.
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Put the new M8000 XT group on it (swap some 105 5800 compact cranks in the make up for the 68mm bottom bracket) with some nice Paul bits if you want and a wheelset built up using the H+Son Archetype rims.
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1x with a clutch XT derailleur and friction shifters.
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I really like Sugino cranks
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1 x 10 with a short cage Zee clutch mech and shifter. SLX or XT discs with the finned icetech pads, flat pedals (sealed trailmix if you can find them), widest tyres you can fit. slx cranks with a single ring oval ideally (oval rings are fantastic).
:)
G.
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(https://lfgss.microco.sm/api/v1/files/53eb347cbfd72821b25f2a5f7c5f15cdaebc82cf.jpg)
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You should give drops a bash, the multiple hand positions are a godsend on long rides. Maybe get some wide ones with sweep (salsa woodchipper come to mind), and match up with some cross top brake levers for control
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I'm with Kinchy on the multiple hand positions. If you definitely don't want drops maybe consider something like these (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/7d/fb/78/7dfb78f0b7825b802cc0ad4877998048.jpg)
You get a more upright riding position than with drops and still have multiple hand placement options and looks pretty cool if you ask me.
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(https://lfgss.microco.sm/api/v1/files/53eb347cbfd72821b25f2a5f7c5f15cdaebc82cf.jpg)
That bike is a hot tranny. Sure, it is hot at first glance but then you start to notice is a little off, then way off. Hopefully before you're riding it.
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(https://lfgss.microco.sm/api/v1/files/53eb347cbfd72821b25f2a5f7c5f15cdaebc82cf.jpg)
That bike is a hot tranny. Sure, it is hot at first glance but then you start to notice is a little off, then way off. Hopefully before you're riding it.
That bike's more like the hairy, overweight neighbor who likes to wear a dress occasionally: looks like shit from any distance.
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This may serve as inspiration for your build.
http://theradavist.com/2014/11/jonathans-surly-disc-trucker-light-tourer/#23
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(https://lfgss.microco.sm/api/v1/files/53eb347cbfd72821b25f2a5f7c5f15cdaebc82cf.jpg)
That bike is a hot tranny. Sure, it is hot at first glance but then you start to notice is a little off, then way off. Hopefully before you're riding it.
HAHAH I'm dying
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Love how this thread is getting way more activity than any bmx stuff.
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Put drops on. You don't have to use them but you'll appreciate em if you do.
Avoid SRAM, XTR is only for race. XT/SLX is more than suitable for what you need.
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This may serve as inspiration for your build.
http://theradavist.com/2014/11/jonathans-surly-disc-trucker-light-tourer/#23
That looks great. I'm probably going to go with a similar build actually. XT with a double crankset. Simple and sturdy
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Go XT 1x11. Honestly didn't think I'd like a 1x11 setup, but once you ride in a 34-10, up to a 34-42, there isn't too much you miss out on.
Shimano has at least brought out the XT 2x11 if you're still wanting to rock the 24-28t chainring. That, and Salsa Bend2 bars.
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Get some comfy Rando style drops like Nitto B135s.
What about a 29" MTB tyre'd Monstercross build?
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endless Crosscheck pron here http://forums.mtbr.com/surly/cross-check-pics-please-539505.html
I had a Pake C'mute for some time and I think it was better suited for the style of riding you want to do with it. I have a Salsa Vaya now for the same reason- tall head tube and stable geometry. The Crosscheck is a great bike though.
since the CC is limited to rim brakes, I recommend skipping the cantis and get some linear pull "V" brakes. I swore I could get by with cantis for a long time, and they certainly look better on this style of bike IMO, but linear pull brakes just have gobs more stopping power and less fatigue on your hands. get full-sized Vs, not "mini" v-brakes. Minis always seemed to have too much moosh and will limit room for mounting fenders.
*edit* however, full-sized linear pull brakes preclude the use of intergated brake lever/shifters that would go on drop bars. you could use v-drop levers (Tektro and Cane Creek make those) with bar-end shifters or Gevenalle lever/shifters with linear pull brakes.
what size frame did you get and how tall are you? drop bars= short TT, flat bars = longer TT. as I am 5'9", my mountain bike has a TT (effective) of 600mm and a 60mm stem. my road bike has a 540mm TT and a 100mm stem, but I could stand to put a shorter stem on the road bike. because drops, bullhorns, moustache bars, etc put the neutral hand position further forward than flat bars, so if you put drops on a bike that fits you well with flat bars, it's going to be too long.
my beef with the CC is that the head tube is very short, so you have to put a tall stem and a stupid stack of spacers on the headset to get the handlebar up high enough to ride comfortably for an old fart like me.
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you should probably just get drops. touring or trying to ride fair distances or at speed on flat bar/alt bar bikes is generally very slow and not too comfortable. you might not want to look like a spandex nerd or think they look funny but theres no real reason to avoid them on a bike like the xcheck. you can get sufficiently rad off road on drops (especially a cx bike designed to do so) and they work across a much wider range than flat or swept back upright bars.
id just get a road group, 105 or ultegra or the shimano cx group. unless you're just going to ride it like a mtb in which case ... buy an mtb.
id go with mini v's, teh cheap shimanos or trp ones. fuck canti fuckery or paying out the ass for paul products.
get some fenders and decent tires, i like resist nomads and panaracer gravelkings for tires.
for fucks sake do not set it up 1x. with some variation of a 50/36 or 48/34ish crank and an 11-28/12-27/12-30/12-32 cassette you will have not too much trouble riding over almost anything outside of gnarbo mtb singletrack. and you'll be able to maintain some decent speed on the road without having to spin ur little single ring up to 1842098rpm.
and if you want to carry shit (you do) get a handlebar bag you can access while riding, its super convenient for your food or to put excess clothing during long rides. look into panniers or frame bags for more storage for touring gear
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for fucks sake do not set it up 1x. with some variation of a 50/36 or 48/34ish crank and an 11-28/12-27/12-30/12-32 cassette you will have not too much trouble riding over almost anything outside of gnarbo mtb singletrack. and you'll be able to maintain some decent speed on the road without having to spin ur little single ring up to 1842098rpm.
1 x 10 is not that unreasonable a suggestion.
50/36 to a 12-27 is a 3.125 gear range.
11-36 is a 3.27 gear range (so wider).
Yes all your other cassette suggestions are a little wider but they aren't that far off (and there are wider cassettes available if you know you need more range) personally I have never missed those very top end gears.
Depending on terrain and assuming you pick your sizes sensibly it can work just fine.
I would be more worried about efficiency. 1 x 10 has a fairly big issue with chain angle and I DO worry about the very poor chainline in low gears giving reduced efficiency just when you least want to sacrifice it (slogging up hills). However, having been running 1 x 10 for a while (and coming from a negative bias towards it initially) I have been totally won over.
Losing a shifter, a mech, a cable, clattering chain, dropped chain and just having one lever to shift is so nice that it makes up for any downside.
:)
G.
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the thing is, riding/exloring/touring on the road (or "all roads" gravel, dirt), you are generally traveling at within a pretty narrow range of speed all things considered. which is where having the cassette with narrower spacing comes in handy. the jumps in gear spacing of 1x drivetrains does not lend its self to the generally steady state style of on road riding very well. unless you're willing to adapt...
it is not such a big deal off road, where i think 1x is fantastic (on city bikes too, if the city is relatively flat) and the larger jumps between gears make sense because you are making a lot more changes in speed and momentum. but on the road i really do not feel it is the best option.
a front mech and associated hardware is very simple to setup and maintain as well. its also extremely good at keeping the chain on the chainring.
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I think your spot on.
I really have been riding my fairdale a bunch these past compple months and I'm gearing up to do asome longer tours down the coast... I do like my 1x setup a bunch and it is great for how and where I ride, but I ride alot of road so pushing a big gear or a weird cadence isnt terriblly to get used to. All things considered I would probably switch my setup to a 2x for touring if I was going to have to haaul gear and shit for 600 miles.
1x10 with barend shifter
paul keeper
xt cranks 38t
ultegra cassette 1128
d/a 7800 rear mech
just installed a super nova light system on it because im stupid and like being broke.
(https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/hphotos-xpf1/t51.2885-15/e15/10632167_335307366628989_1181110646_n.jpg)
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the thing is, riding/exloring/touring on the road (or "all roads" gravel, dirt), you are generally traveling at within a pretty narrow range of speed all things considered. which is where having the cassette with narrower spacing comes in handy. the jumps in gear spacing of 1x drivetrains does not lend its self to the generally steady state style of on road riding very well. unless you're willing to adapt...
it is not such a big deal off road, where i think 1x is fantastic (on city bikes too, if the city is relatively flat) and the larger jumps between gears make sense because you are making a lot more changes in speed and momentum. but on the road i really do not feel it is the best option.
a front mech and associated hardware is very simple to setup and maintain as well. its also extremely good at keeping the chain on the chainring.
The thing is that you started out saying "for fucks sake do not set it up 1x", and went on to justify this by claiming that you would be spinning out all the time; so I pointed out that this was not as bad as you were making out.
Now, you are saying that it is the larger jumps between gears that make this so totally unacceptable, but this is really not as serious as you make out either. There will always be weird jumps on any cassette because you have to change by whole tooth increments; eg. 11 to 12 is a (relatively small) 9% change, while 11 to 13 is a relatively big 18% jump, this is obviously an extreme example but all through the cassette you have this dilemma. Sure you can shift at both ends to mitigate this, but you then have gears that are redundantly close together and the rider has to be experienced and concentrating enough to make use of these. You need to remember what gear you are in and where the next one is.
So I'm sorry, but I think you are being unreasonable in completely dismissing 1x as an option. For someone on a serious touring forum asking about a build to ride across a continent then you might be close to the mark, but for a guy asking in terms of general use, on a BMX forum, who already specified that they would be running flat bars, I think it would be an excellent option to consider.
:)
G.
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Regarding the handlebar choice- do sure to pick your frame size based on handlebar type. flat bar- long top tube. drop bar- short top tube. I love my Salsa Cowbells. Salsa also makes a super-flared out Woodchipper bar, and just came out with a mid-flare cowchipper, which looks awesome indeed. dirt drops are something completely different, don't confuse yourself with those.
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just installed a super nova light system on it because im stupid and like being broke.
(https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/hphotos-xpf1/t51.2885-15/e15/10632167_335307366628989_1181110646_n.jpg)
that thing is rad. seriously considered getting one of those at some point.
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Regarding the handlebar choice- do sure to pick your frame size based on handlebar type. flat bar- long top tube. drop bar- short top tube. I love my Salsa Cowbells. Salsa also makes a super-flared out Woodchipper bar, and just came out with a mid-flare cowchipper, which looks awesome indeed. dirt drops are something completely different, don't confuse yourself with those.
I've never thought of that before but I guess it makes sense. How much bigger should I go for a flatcar setup? Extra 2cm?
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how tall are you? there is a massive thread in the Surly sub-forum on MTBR somewhere about Crosscheck sizing that might be helpful. for reference, I am 5'9" and I ride a bike with something like a 600mm effective top tube, which is usually designated as a "medium" size. you might be able to compare some other bikes with similar sizes that are more specific about sizing recommendations as well.
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Ahh sweet. No idea. I'm like 5ft 8 I think. I just want to throw flat bars and a cetma rack on a road bike haha
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ballpark sizing for someone your size with "flat" bars would be 575-600mm effective top tube. a road bike with drop bars would be more like 540mm ETT.
if you put a flat bar on a drop-bar bike your size, the reach will feel very short and upright. good news if you have back problems and want to sit upright like it is a beach cruiser, bad news if you want to go fast.
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Regarding the handlebar choice- do sure to pick your frame size based on handlebar type. flat bar- long top tube. drop bar- short top tube. I love my Salsa Cowbells. Salsa also makes a super-flared out Woodchipper bar, and just came out with a mid-flare cowchipper, which looks awesome indeed. dirt drops are something completely different, don't confuse yourself with those.
You can adjust stem length/height and seat fore/aft to compensate for different bar types... obviously its not as ideal as having custom fit geo but i cant afford that either. My fairdale is made for some backsweep flat bars, i Need a layback post pretty bad...
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No. saddle position has nothing to do with reach. saddle position is for placing your pelvis in the ideal position for your pedal stroke. most people go by KOPS (knee over pedal spindle), where you position your saddle such that your knee is directly over your pedal spindle when the cranks and feet are level. some people like their seat a little behind the KOPS position, or perhaps in front, but either way, it's a good place to start.
if you are trying to make up for a bike that is too short by putting a seatpost with more offset on it, you are going to fuck up your pedal stroke and eventually hurt your knees. I know this from personal experience. if your reach on your bike is too short, you need a bigger frame, longer stem or different handlebar or some combination of the two.
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it's worth pointing out that if you plan on riding some decent distances on this bike it's a good idea to buy a good pair of cycling shorts. I know they look ridiculous and it's easy to hate on lycra. We've all done it because, lets face it, how can you not? but they will make your ride 100 times more comfortable.
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wear padded lycra shorts under some "normal" athletic, comfortable shorts. sorted.
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wear padded lycra shorts under some "normal" athletic, comfortable shorts. sorted.
^^^ This. I just use cheap decathlon ones under old shorts, works fine.
:)
G.